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Topic: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak (Read 958 times) previous topic - next topic
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Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Yahoo Message Number: 1979
I have a Four Winds on the Kodiak C5500 chassis and have run into a
recurring issue with the Alcoa wheels running off center on the front
of the coach creating excessive bounce. Upon investigation, two issues
have surfaced. The first was out-of-round Goodyears, which after 4 new
tires, we finally found a mounting proceedure that would eliminate most
of the run-out to below 70 mils on both front tires/rims. Once mounted
on the vehicle, we found that the Alcoa rims do not ride the hub pilot
tabs tightly and result in 100+ mils of potential mis centering, if you
are not careful to visually center the rim lug openings on the lugs.
After tighting the lugs to specification, the tires/rims run true, for
a while then the bounce returns. Checking the run-out of the tire/rims
indicate that they are still in spec (per Goodyear) thus the problem is
at the hub-pilot to Alcoa rim mount. It seems that the rim moves on
the hub even with the proper torque on the flange nuts.

Has anyone else experienced this issue with this setup? Thanks

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1980
After working for 40 years in automotive industry servicing
mounting/inflating and balancing tire and wheel assemblies machines. I
find it hard to believe the wheels are changing location. Sound like a
tire dealer making claims that are not true.
Both front and rear wheels have been off my Kodiak several times with
no problems with wheel centering. If there are changes after mounting
and installing wheel and tire assemblies I would be concerned about
proper mounting and inflating of tires. Proper lubrication of tire is
required to get beads to seat properly at original inflation.
Otherwise tire is going to move after being driven on road.
You may need to take your truck to a place that specializes in
balancing front tire and wheels on vehicle.

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1981
The rub with balancing on-vehicle is that the tread surface lopes
nearly 200 mils. The run out on the tire/rim assembly before you
install on the hub is less than 70 mils. The rims do not self center
on the hub-pilots when mounted to the hub. The only way we have been
able to get the rim centered on the hub is to visually center the rim
bore holes on the lug and run-out on the vehicle. That works
initially, the hub-pilots are not touching the rim in this situation.
After you drive the coach, especially in high heating situations such
as city driving, we have found that a couple of the hub-pilots are now
touching the rim and the lope is back. Take the tires off the coach,
the run-out is in spec and balance is dead-on. Put the rims back on the
coach with the visual mounting procedure and your back in business for
a while.
I have had this coach to two separate highly respected commercial tire
facilities in my area. They both have spent a significant amount of
time working the problem. I am not wanting to "easter egg" this issue
any longer and would like to see if someone else has found/solved a
similar issue.

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1982

I also own a Four Winds product, and had a similar problem when I first bought the coach, only my rims were steel, not aluminum. After much frustration balancing/rebalancing at Les Schwab tire dealerships, I was told ALL of my tires were out of round, and I had the Goodyears replaced with Michelins. The bouncing is gone but the vibration is still there at speed around 60-65mph.. Can't figure it out.

The Goodyears were built during a strike in late 2006 and early 2007. I suspect your aluminum rims were built in China. See if you can get specs on the rims.... Good luck.

Denny

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #4 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1983
I have Michelin tires on Alcoa wheels. I had a flat fixed about 300
miles ago. No problems yet.

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #6 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1985
My original tires were from 2006 lot codes. Goodyear replaced them
without any questions. The newer tires eliminated most of the run-out
for the tire/rim assembly to within spec from Goodyear.

I was hoping that someone on the group had steel rims, as you do, since
the commercial tire dealer was willing to temp mount the tires on steel
rims. Unfortunately, it sounds like you are experiencing the same
issue. My vibration occurs above 60 mph also.

It was suggested that a set of bushings installed over the lugs that
center the rim bore on the lug might be the only permanent solution.

Rich

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #9 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1988
My Kodiak came with Michelin's. Because of a bad alignment front tires
went bald within 900 miles after we purchased MH used from dealer.
Replaced them with Goodyears. We have driven over 25,000 with zero
problems. Tire are dated 2005.
Your dimension of 200 mils is??? .200" sounds about normal. .07"
clearance is normal for wheel bore. This kind of clearance is needed
to stop bore from closing up when wheel and hub get hot.
Have you checked the shocks. There purpose is to keep tire on ground.
The OEM shock leave a lot to be desired. As Denny said, there have
been some problems with Goodyear tires.
The run out should be OK for a Kodiak. There could be some problems
with the internals of tire that cause it to not run turn when hitting
road. Hard to find a place that can do a force variation test on tires.
Here is a thread on RV.Net about it. But most do not understand how or
what it is about.
http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/22126912.cfm
Maybe you need to try some Michelin's?

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #10 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1989

Most Les Schwab dealers have road force balancing equipment.

Denny

Re: Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #11 –
Yahoo Message Number: 1990
I have had six different tires on the rims to date. We have swapped
left and right fronts several times. If it is the tires, then they have
a systemic problem of radial force variation as the "Hunter" article
you sent me discusses.(very complete and interesting discussion). That
article also suggests that the compounded run out tolerances of the
rim/hub/tire will cause the same issue.
I replaced the front shocks with Bilsteins several months back. One of
the OEM front shocks had little damping action left.
I also did a weight balance check to see if the front was to lightly
loaded. All was within balance norms with nominal loading.
You may be right on the Michelins.. Nevertheless, after six tires from
very different lot codes, I just don't think that they are going to
make this problem go away.

Rich

Re: (Update) Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #12 –
Yahoo Message Number: 2073
After several attempts at tire balance and run in correction, I
purchased these hub centering inserts for the steerage tires on the
Kodiak:

http://www.tru-
bal.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/category.display/category_id/239/External_C
entering_Sleeve.cfm

These are the TRU-BALANCE external centering sleeves that self centers
the wheels to the hub via the lugs.

I put 350 highway miles at various speeds and the problem has been
corrected.

Rich

Re: (Update) Alcoa Wheel Centering on Kodiak

Reply #13 –
Yahoo Message Number: 2074

Thanks, Rich, for this useful information. I have also have had a front end vibration that was unexplained. Will have to try them.

Denny