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Toad change

Yahoo Message Number: 5471
We are in the process of changing toads. For the past 3 years and 9 months our toad has been a 2007 Tahoe LTZ. It was a nothing to tow behind a 41 ft DP. The Kodiak gasser towed it reasonably well but nothing like the DP.

Today, in a weak moment I bought a 2011 Ford Escape Ltd 4WD to replace my wife's 2006 Equinox. That will be our toad.

I also bought a 2010 Ford Flex AWD Limited to replace the Tahoe. Almost bought a 2011 Lincoln MkX but decided I wanted something larger. The MkX was very nice and just loaded with high tech stuff - in fact, too much.

Now, I've got to get the Escape fitted with Blue Ox base plates before we head south in late October.

Anyone in the group towing an Escape? If you are, what did it cost to have the baseplates installed? How did the installation go? I've got a few quotes and don't like any of them. We don't need any wiring as we will either use our BO Light Bar (if I get a trailer hitch installed) or get mag lights. I can install the Brake Buddy breakaway connector myself.

Thanks

Don

Re: Toad change

Reply #1 –
Yahoo Message Number: 5474
Don if I had you money I would throw mine on the road. HA, Congratulations and hope you enjoy your new rides. Our Seneca is still in the shop awaiting parts that are to be in on Monday. Been a month now but as always Jayco comes through. Hope this fixes the slide issue once and for all. Best Regards to Family! Dane

Re: Toad change

Reply #2 –
Yahoo Message Number: 5481
I thought you were a GM family.
There were some problems with the Escape having trans problems while towing. May not apply to 4wd.
Best
Ron Hall

 

Re: Toad change

Reply #3 –
Yahoo Message Number: 5482
Yes Ron, they changed a number of transmissions that burned out. The problem was dip stick calibration and the transmission was overfilled. Ford replaced them no questions asked. I sure hope the problem resolved and doesn't occur again. You have to run the engine for 5 minutes and got through the gears and do this every 8 hours. Also a speed cap of 65 mph.

Here is the LONG story on the reasons for the switch. If you have trouble sleeping at night save it until this evening and it will do the trick for a full night's sleep.

We do have 3 Bow Ties (Kodiak, Tahoe and Equinox). However. GM seems to think its products are now gold coated and the employee prices were awful. Last Sunday we saw an 2011 Equinox LTZ had just arrived at the dealer. Enquired about the employee price and was shocked when the discount was only 7.6% - $2700. Then it got worse, they absolutely low-balled us on the trade - the 2006 Equinox with about 32,000 miles and another year of full warranty (Equinox was LT with AWD, leather, 3.4L six, sunroof, heated seats, etc). The 2011 was a 4 cylinder FWD only. I took it out for a test drive and found it sounded like a sewing machine. When merging on to a nearby highway and accelerating it was up to 5500 rpm so quickly I was surprised. At 60 mph it did cruise nicely at under 2000 revs though thanks to the 6 speed. It had a backup camera (in the rear view mirror) and backup warning sensors (something DW wanted) and things like a sunroof were standard. DW really wanted the AWD and that would have to be ordered and then our trade would be priced in 2-3 months - when we would be in Florida. I also asked about the employee price on a nice 2011 Cadillac SRX they had on the lot. Employee Discount $3500. These discounts were well below what we got in the past.

So, I went down the street to the Ford dealer as Ford was advertising employee prices for everyone. They had was she wanted - 2011 Escape AWD Limited with the backup camera (better model than GMs as it has center and left and right guidelines on it) and backup sensors (6 cylinder, sunroof, leather and a bunch of other options that don't register on her) and an employee discount of 14.9% - $4900+. Initial pricing on our trade started higher than the GM dealer but that still wasn't adequate. Eventually they came up to the Black Book value when I walked (at that point it was two new cars or none).

After I test drove the Escape (the 3.0L six sounded far less like a sewing machine than the 2.4L in the Equinox) I tried a Flex and was very impressed with it (2010 model so a double discount) - top of the line AWD Limited and with Nav system, 4 panel sunroof and even a fridge freezer. Drove well and at 60 mph revs were fine. That 6 speed they developed with GM (for $1.4 billion!!!!!) does work well with the 2 overdrive ratios.

Then, I saw a Lincoln MkX that was loaded to the hilt and it had blind spot warning on it, adaptive cruise and a host of things including 305 hp. It drove well. Next day I came back with the Tahoe so they could put a price on it. Ha - low low ball even allowing for $1000 hit for a tiny ding in the back bumper. They immediately bumped it up when I gave him the sales manager a glare that could kill. I showed him the Black Book values right from the Ford link. He said they don't use the Black Book they use auction prices. I walked. Couldn't ride. They could not find the keys to the Tahoe. So, they had to put a plate on the MkX and I drove it home. I figured that was a novel way to get me attached to the MkX. Got home and then got a call - another customer took the keys and he didn't live to far from me and would drop them off. So, the fellow came over with them. He is a Doctor and was in his Lexus convertible. He had their Enclave in for a trade on a Flex and since the keys apparently look identical picked up the wrong one and put it in his pocket. I know it was not a planned event because he had some pretty harsh remarks for the deal they were offering him.

I returned the MkX that night and the next day told them the drive home and back convinced me I didn't want it and if we ever did strike a deal it would be for the Flex. I concluded that I wanted one of our two to be larger and the MkX while very nice, really didn't have that much room behind the back seats. Also, the dash in the MkX is a modern marvel of electronics. DW figured I was in heaven with virtually hundreds of choices. On the way back to the dealer we were trying the Sirius radio and other options. Well, what a monster. You'd better spend a few hours with the manual if you buy one of these. Although it provides a ton of info, it is very restricted with respect to how much you can see at one time. If you want fuel economy, when you hit those buttons your tach disappears. When we got back into the Tahoe and on the highway for the trip home we looked at each other and said "no way for the Mk X." That night I got really wound up on trying to select a Flex. One of the options is the Ecoboost engine that is the same 6 but with dual water cooled turbo chargers and other mods - 355 HP and 350 lbs ft of torque. There were a few around available for dealer swaps as I searched the Ford site and I started to lock in on this engine. Next day I phoned a friend in Lansing who has a Flex and in the end decided to go with the standard 262 hp - during the test drive it was more than adequate. But, the Exoboost also had a lot of other steering and suspension modifications and it had the manual mode for the tranny with up and down paddles on the steering wheel.

Late the next day they called back and said that for the two deals they would give me the trade values I wanted. In I went Friday to consummate the deal. In an email I'd laid out the two deals right to the penny (both vehicles get an additional $1000 discount if you were a Costco member when the sale program started - and we were). So, they write it up - but the numbers do NOT jive. What gives. Oh, it seems that they had already PDI'd the vehicles and they had the green valve covers. THAT for the great unwashed like me meant NITROGEN in the tires - a $40 option. It also had the safety lock nuts - one per wheel and they were $100 per set (I've got 3 sets at home already). I said NO, change to regular air and take the lock nuts off. My deal or NO deal. Oh were they pissed - but by this time I'd had my fill with car salesman - but I have to say the salesperson was a 28 year old female who has been in the biz only 2 months but the manager was calling the shots. Finally he said, OK OK OK. When we'd concluded everything (after the Biz Admin tried to sell me the Brooklyn Bridge and Florida Swampland in extras - which I rejected) I said to him "Mark, since you wanted to price my trades at the auction sheet values, why didn't we agree to put the Escape and Flex up for sale at the auction and I'd pay the auction prices if they are such a good indication of value?" His face was more than a little red but the message got across.

As Paul Harvey would say, "Now you have the rest of the story." That is how we went from being a GM family to Ford - and paid about $6k less in total. Well, we still have the Kodiak - gee maybe I should trade it for a Ford based Class C as well. :)

BTW, had I ended up walking from the Ford dealership it was going to be to Chrysler for a Town and Country. Wasn't I surprised when I learned later that the guy who owned the Ford dealership also owns the Chrysler dealership (and the local Jeep, BMW, Mini, Lexus, Toyota, Mercedes, Smart Car, Mazda, Volvo, Jaguar and Range Rover dealerships - as well as Mercedes and Sprinter dealerships in Baltimore and Wilmington in the US). We just moved to the Windsor area 2 years ago and were not aware of his extensive holdings.

I think I'm going to have to consider going back to what I did a couple of times in the 1960s. Get a value for the trade, send the dealer a letter with an offer asking him to call me if it is acceptable (with no changes) and if not don't bother. Sure will get rid of some of the headaches. I don't look forward to our next motorhome switch as it will be a bigger pain when one trades an orphan.

Don